Talk:List of state partition proposals in the United States/Archive 1

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Archive 1

North and South Florida

For the last decade or two there has been a number of talks and resolutions splitting Florida into two states. A quick google search yields plenty of news articles... http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=north+florida+south+florida+split&aq=f&oq=&aqi=

Republic_of_Lakotah

should Republic_of_Lakotah get an entry here? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 168.251.194.18 (talk) 00:08, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Montana

Considering the DC vs Heller case, and Montana threatening to seced, I think it would be wise to add its proposal to the list as well. Mentioning its large nuclear stockpile would also be helpful, probably —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.232.178.197 (talk) 19:40, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

New Mexico

As there was no entry for New Mexico, I thought I'd add my two cents. I've heard stories that after the American Civil War, instead of surrendering by state, invididual counties in the Confederacy were required to surrender to Union officers. As Socorro County in New Mexico had a negligible population at the time, no officer was sent, so the county never officially surrendered - making it the only remaining part of the CSA. This is, for all practical purposes, a technicality (if even true) but might make for an interesting entry. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.184.23.58 (talk) 17:48, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

West Virginia

While the formation of WV as a new U.S. state is worth a mention here in state secession proposals, I don't agree that WV was technically a U.S. state which seceded from another U.S. state. That is because WV seceded from Virginia, which at that point, had become a Confederate State, and was no longer a United State. (See the opening paragraphs.) In contrast, Maine seceded as a U.S. state from Massachusetts, which was also a U.S. state. This is the only case when this has happened. - Keith D. Tyler June 30, 2005 22:18 (UTC)

Disagree. According to Lincoln and the Constitution, the south had no right to secede. Thus the secesion was void and Virginia was a U.S. state at the time. Since either way is showing a POV, I'm going to reword it so as to point out the controversy. Bsd987 02:49, 16 January 2006 (UTC)
If we accept that that is true, then in fact West Virginia didn't secede at all, because it remained loyal to the Union, and represented itself as the government of Virginia. If there was a Virginia in the Union, then the state represented by that government didn't secede. In that case, it was then present-day Virginia which in fact seceded from present-day West Virginia (and the Union). End result: WV didn't secede, but in fact deliberately did not secede while the other part of Virginia did. Point being; the Wheeler government of Virginia did not attempt to secede; it was in fact attempting not to secede but rather to remain in the Union. It was Confederate Virginia that seceded from United Virginia, which later became known as WV after the war and Reconstruction. - Keith D. Tyler 20:46, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

TOC

I think the TOC on this article would benefit from either being compressed (i.e. custom design, cf. List of rail accidents) or having the text floating alongside it - I know this is possible but can't remember how. I wont do it unilaterally as I have not been involved with this article before. Thryduulf 18:48, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

Created a long-overdue state-abbreviation TOC template. - Keith D. Tyler 23:49, August 23, 2005 (UTC)

Florida Panhandle

I remeber that one of my old state history books mentioned that in early Florida history there was a bill to sell the panhandle to Alabama. The alabamaian legislature wasent interested largely due to the cost and pressure from Mobile residents who thought the addition of Pensacola to the state would negatively affect them. Can anyone confrim this with a source and write it up.- Mitrebox

Kansas

Removed

There has been some talk of western Kansas, eastern colorado, and southern Nebraska seceeding and making a "State of the Great Plains"

I've never heard if this, and what's more I couldn't find any reference to it anywhere on the internet. If there is a source (on- or offline) please replace. Cmprince 03:45, 30 December 2005 (UTC)

Sources

In my haste, I neglected to reference/link many of the sources I dug up for generating this article. Nearly everything in it was prompted as the result of something found via a search for "secede from (state)" or "secession from (state)" and etc. But only a few of these got a reflink in the article.

This is a call for help for anyone stopping by to help source any unreferenced entries.

TIA, Keith D. Tyler 22:52, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

Arizona

Removed:

According to the website Free Republic, Arizona legislatures approved a resolution to secede from the Union in the event that the federal government abolishes the U.S. Constitution, declares martial law, or confiscates firearmes. A three-year member of the Legislature, Karen Johnson, calls the move "an insurance policy" against an increasingly powerful federal government. So far, however, nothing more has come of this proposal.

This is uncited, but undeniably refers to Arizona HCR 2034 [1], which (despite the recycled headlines) does not propose secession -- actually, it proposes dissolution of the federal government, which is much more significant than secession. It also has not been put to a vote according to [2], so it certainly has not been "approved". (So much for the factual integrity of Free Republic.) - Keith D. Tyler (AMA) 21:48, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

Oklahoma

The article said that there has been a movement in Tulsa to seperate from Oklahoma because the rest of the state is more rural and isn't as cultural. ...I removed this statement. The only 2 sources to back it up were a public message board where someone jokingly suggested the idea in their discussion, and the other is a blank website. There are no references anywhere on the internet to this statement. --Okiefromokla 17:16, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

Lower in that forum, David Arnett refers to an article he wrote "a decade ago" for the Oklahoma Gazette titled "Why Tulsa Wants To Secede From Oklahoma". The OKG's online archives don't go back far enough, alas. - Keith D. Tyler (AMA) 20:21, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
Eastern Oklahoma is a major hub of the state's and country's

American Indian population, due to its historical setting as Indian Territory from 1836 to 1907. The Five Civilized Tribes (i.e. the Cherokee, Choctaw and Creek nations) attempted to establish the State of Sequoyah in 1905 with little success and eventually merged with the state of Oklahoma two years later. The debate is more serious if some members of the AIM (American Indian Movement) in the state sought a separate republic in the eastern half of Oklahoma as the world's first American Indian republic. + 71.102.53.48 (talk) 07:58, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Proposals for new U.S. states

I notice that there are articles about proposals for new states in Canada and Australia but not the U.S. Someone should make one.  :) Laikalynx 02:19, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

There is: 51st state and List of U.S. state secession proposals. —Nightstallion (?) 23:48, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

Montgomery County, Maryland

I remember having read a column in The Montgomery Journal in the early eighties, advocating that Montgomery County secede from Maryland and join the District of Columbia in its quest for statehood. It was less a serious proposal than a protest against the way in which Maryland treated the county as a cash cow and was otherwise hostile to the county. I did a quick Web search but didn't find anything. Does anyone recall this or, better, have a cite for something similar? Thanks. Doctor Whom 19:47, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

Louisiana

The Free State of Winn. & Winn parish succeded from Louisiana

I can find nothing that shows that Winn parish actualy stayed part of the union. Where is the cite?

I did find this quote

The political sentiment in Winn Parish in early 1861 was generally against secession. David Pierson, a young attorney, was elected to represent the parish at the secession convention called by Governor Moore in Baton Rouge in January 1861. True to his commitment to the folks back home, Pierson voted against secession in all votes taken and refused, along with several others, to change his "no" vote at the end of the process when asked to do so in order that the vote for secession be made unanimous.

His duty done, Pierson then returned to Winn Parish and raised the first company of Confederate volunteers from the parish - Company C, 3rd Louisiana Infantry. Pierson played a prominent role commanding the regiment at Vicksburg and was promoted to Lieutenant Colonel of the regiment.

Without some type of evidence other than one guy that keeps posting this story around the net it should be removed from here and on the winn parish la page and the winnfield la page.

--Sattmaster (talk) 21:42, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Texas

As a long time Texas resident, I have never heard a proposal to separate Houston from the rest of the state. No major media or political group has ever endorsed this, and a Google search for the phrase "city state of Houston" found only 3 references: This article, another writer who is clearly not serious, and a spammy-looking web site.

I also question this statement: "As Houston is relatively less affulent, and has a higher crime in relative to the rest of the state." [sic] Houston has a lower crime rate than Dallas (although higher than Austin). It has a higher income than Laredo, San Antonio, and several other cities. [3]

There have been many humorous and a few serious discussions of dividing Texas, usually into five states. The article could mention this Google Answer: http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=760350 Is this a good reference for the Wikipedia?

Otherwise, the current entry should be deleted entirely.

Marzolian 23:36, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Indiana

"During the period leading up to the Civil War, Indiana remained torn between whether or not to join the Confederate States of America or remain with the Union. The state ended up remaining loyal to President Lincoln during the war. Today, there is a very small group that is petitioning to form a Republic of Indiana." where is the source? - signed by an anon IP

Try using the google search engine by the word "Republic of Indiana", but many state secessionist movements tend to fold or disband in short time. The now-defunct Republic of California had an official web site, it's a dead link but was already verified by Wikipedia as a reliable source to back evidence. Indiana, along with the states of Delaware, Kansas, Kentucky, Maryland, Missouri and Ohio were known as the "border states" during the Civil war. Portions of the "border" states declare themselves pro-Union, pro-Confederate or the "third position" as independent republics: to be neutral or support one side over the another. One state created during the civil war was the pro-Union West Virginia from the state of Virginia in 1863. Territories laying out west were neutral, but the New Mexico Territory had a pro-Confederate government that never gained real power and the territory was split in 1863 into Arizona in the western half, instead of the Anglo-ruled but pro-Union Republican northern or the Latino-majority southern halves plan. The Mormon majority Territory of Deseret was already under a pro-Union government that excluded Mormons, whom showed more of a neutrality stance, but approved a law to permit slavery to get more non-Mormon settlers. Indian Territory of Oklahoma was pro-Confederate, they supplied all-Indian tribal batallions to fight in the battle of Pea Ridge, Arkansas, and finally the notably racist yet pro-Union territories in the Northwest had welcomed former Confederate officials to settle in their lands. + 71.102.2.206 (talk) 16:25, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

State of Riviera?

<<A proposal to make the Colorado River basin of easternmost California (Imperial, parts of Riverside and San Bernardino) and three western Arizona counties (Mohave, Yuma and La Paz) into a separate state known as Riviera and the possible state capital would be either in Blythe, California or Yuma, Arizona the area's largest city in population.>> Can anyone assist on finding any sources for this rumor? The Colorado River basin has felt distant from state officials in both Sacramento and Phoenix. There are over 600,000 residents in the six-county zone (actually 10,000 square miles of the Riverside/San Bernardino county area) which does qualify for statehood according to requirements in the US constitution. + 71.102.53.48 (talk) 07:55, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Washington, D.C.

The article contained a statement that alleged there are "plans" to merge the District with its surrounding suburban counties and cities. There was no source citation listed. As no plans have actually been made, I am deleting the statement. Quacks Like a Duck (talk) 17:23, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Utah

I made an entry and was deleted in a minute: << Some Utahns like those in the state legislature believe their state could one day be split into two, the future state boundary of Utah (Salt Lake City) and another state, is located somewhere south of Nephi, Utah and represents a lesser populated part of the state. >>

I recall a Utah state senator commented on the likelihood for rural counties located south of Utah County, Utah where Provo is, will separate and become another state. The hypothetical new state of Southern Utah may have less than 500,000 people and the main cities are Cedar City, Utah with Southern Utah college, Salina, Utah in the region's center, and St. George, Utah said to have over 200,000 residents in rapidly-growing Washington County, Utah alone. + 71.102.53.48 (talk) 22:48, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

Note that "Southern Utah" has since been added, using Neal Hendrickson's 2008 bill as a source. - Keith D. Tyler 06:07, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Hawaii

Hawaii is not mentioned, even tho I believe Hawaiian sovereignty movement is of the same or related subject. --Voidvector (talk) 06:00, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

The distinction is made early on between "secession from a state", which the article indicates it covers, as opposed to separatist movements, which is where Hawaiian independence would (and currently does) belong. - Keith D. Tyler 18:33, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
Hmm. perhaps this article is a little unclear in the sense that it isn't clear about whether it means U.S. state secession, as in from the United States (overall), or parts of U.S. states seceeding but remaining new elements or part of the United States of America. Today Yahoo has news coverage on protesters in Hawaii talking about the right to break away from the United States.

CaribDigita (talk) 15:32, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

Adding new proposals

When adding information on secession proposals not already mentioned, please ensure you read the first sentence of the article first. - Keith D. Tyler 18:06, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

30+ states declaring sovereignty

http://www.mrstep.com/politics/az-wa-mo-nh-ok-claiming-sovereignty/

can anyone add this.someone needs to create a separate article about state sovereignty as this movement is not about secession. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.163.194.46 (talk) 12:49, 27 February 2009 (UTC)

That article would properly be Tenth Amendment to the United States Constitution. - Keith D. Tyler 06:02, 28 February 2009 (UTC)
The extreme tool for secession from the U.S. instead of a state, but the web site link is about secession of states into separate republics or countries declaring indepedence from the U.S. and one reason is neglect by state government as well. Like the Gulf Coast of Alabama, Florida & Mississippi were partially state-secession, but half anti-federal to find the two options for statehood or independence if they hadn't got any way, both to unite the historical region of the Gulf Coast and to become more autonomous in their political affairs of the region. + 71.102.2.206 (talk) 16:17, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

federal secession proposals

Pursuant to the first two sentences of the article (but prompted by the addition of the same passage about Cascadia in five places), I'm removing the following. They should be moved elsewhere and a link to that article added to the top section. —Tamfang (talk) 02:53, 7 September 2009 (UTC)

  • The Alaskan Independence Party is a political party agitating for a repeal of the 1959 referendum admitting Alaska to the United States. Despite the successful gathering of the required signatures for a ballot initiative in 2006, the Alaska Supreme Court ruled in Kohlhaas v. State that this secession proposal was unconstitutional, and disallowed the measure from appearing on ballots.
  • In 1991, State Representative Mike Jaros proposed that Minnesota secede in response to the First Gulf War. Congressman Jim Oberstar convinced Jaros not to proceed, so the bill (which was sponsored by six other legislators) was not submitted.
  • Vermont has a movement organized to secede from the United States called the Second Vermont Republic (called the "Second Republic" because Vermont was an independent country for fourteen years). This movement coalesced in a series of meetings in 2003 and resulted in the release of The Vermont Manifesto and the organization of a civic club whose goal is independence for Vermont. Second Vermont Republic is organized to such a degree that it is active over all of Vermont. The secession movement has brought the issue of Vermont independence up in some Vermont town meetings, it has produced books and videos, has its own think tank (The Middlebury Institute), its own media outlet (Vermont Commons), and held a well-attended (over 300 people) convention inside the capitol building in Montpelier.

Added these secession proposals of the national level: -AngusWOOF (talk) 19:26, 12 September 2014 (UTC)

  • On July 13, 1977, the town of Kinney in northern Minnesota announced its secession from the Union, in hopes of receiving foreign aid from the U.S. government. The new nation, called the Republic of Kinney, The national news story broke on February 7, 1978. Many in the town still claim its independence.[4][5]
  • Because of laws restricting fishing, some residents of the tiny Northwest Angle region of the state suggested leaving the United States and joining Canada in 1997. The following year, U.S. Representative Collin Peterson proposed a constitutional amendment that would allow the residents of the Northwest Angle, which is part of his district, to vote on seceding from the United States and joining Canada, angering the leaders of Red Lake Indian Reservation, which holds most of the Northwest Angle's land.[6][7] The Northwest Angle is not connected by road to the rest of the state, and can only be accessed by land through Manitoba, Canada.
  • In the 1830s, a portion of New Hampshire called the Republic of Indian Stream declared its independence in protest at being claimed and taxed by both the United States and British Canada. It maintained its own organized, elected government for three years before being occupied by the New Hampshire Militia.

Too many removed edits for being unsourced

Almost every state of the union has at least one secession movement, except the very small ones of Vermont, Delaware and Rhode Island, historically came from 18th century colonial rebellions to secede from the other colonial government. The Baja Arizona movement based in Tucson was edited out of the article, yet one can find plenty of sources about the state secessionist drive to split Arizona into two halves on newspapers and internet. The proposed state boundary will be the Gila River, but south of the Phoenix suburb of Apache Junction, Arizona and north of Yuma, that is if the proposal passes in US congress. + 71.102.7.77 (talk) 20:03, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

Would that also inculde some of the southern parts of New Mexico, like of the last purchise made in 1850 s/t? for the record i'm love to see that :) --75.94.196.171 (talk) 23:42, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

I think there are too many examples in this article. I, personally, would rather not see this particular case in if it's not going to amount to anything. Unless it were to come up to a vote, it's meaningless. Many things on this page are...Smarkflea (talk) 13:51, 7 July 2011 (UTC)

Page needs a serious fix

in addision to what is said above on how many article has been removed disbite the presence of infomation to back them likke Baja Arizonia, this page also repeats itself in many places, and makes it a boring read. I suggest to anyone, or when I have got the time, to clean up this page of repeats. What one could do is if a secession ivoldes mutiplie states, just make another section for muti state secessions that cross broders, identily what States are efffected, and puts the info there in once instead of muti times as it is atm. --75.94.196.171 (talk) 00:00, 30 March 2010 (UTC)

Undoubtedly the page needs work, but as for being a "boring read" -- it is a list, after all, not an article per se. Beyond My Ken (talk) 01:27, 30 March 2010 (UTC)

rename?

The present title "List of U.S. state secession proposals" is a problem: its most obvious meaning, at least arguably, is proposals to secede from the United States. The content would (I suggest) be better served by changing the word "secession" to "partition". Opinions? —Tamfang (talk) 03:45, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

No comment in over a month, so here we go. —Tamfang (talk) 04:33, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

What about merges and other such changes? If those are added, that would mean chaning the title again. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.219.13.87 (talk) 04:49, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

a choice of constitutions

This makes the kind of sense that's not:

An earlier crop of state secession sentiments appear in the period between the signing of the Articles of Confederation in 1781, and the signing of the Constitution in 1789, often related to internal differences in preference of one over the other.

(For 'signing' read ratification.) The two were never in effect at the same time. Perhaps this writer had in mind the period between the proposal (1787) and the last ratification (1790) of the second? The article mentions one such movement, in Rhode Island; is there any more to this "crop"? —Tamfang (talk) 07:32, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

intro add to Maine?

Successful partition following Constitutional procedure might not only be Maine out of Massachusetts, but Kentucky out of Virginia and Tennessee out of North Carolina. TheVirginiaHistorian (talk) 13:00, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

Were those states made directly out of other states, or out of lands that the 'parent' states had yielded to Congress (before the Second Constitution)? —Tamfang (talk) 18:25, 11 April 2011 (UTC)
They were counties of the 'parent' state, with representation in the state legislatures, as was Maine of Massachusetts.
Ohio had representatives in the Virginia Assembly, as did Illinois, but Maryland would not sign the Articles of Confederation until Virginia gave up its claims and citizens north of the Ohio River. TheVirginiaHistorian (talk) 23:07, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

Virginia nets 61 lost counties in six events

There's a fun interactive map, by year or by animation, to be had at "County Formation in Virginia 1617-1995". Each County sent two delegates to the Virginia State Assembly in Richmond, Virginia. So, we obtain:

Ohio County of 1776 that divides into what will later become WV counties of Brooke 1797, and parts into Harrison 1810, Tyler 1814 and Marshall 1835.

  • Illinois County 1778 north of the Ohio River is ceded to the US for the Northwest Territory 1784. Also Ohio County Virginians north of the Ohio River.
  • Kentucky County of 1777 that becomes Fayette 1780, Jefferson 1780, and Lincoln 1780,
then Bourbon, Nelson, Mercer, Madison, Mason and Woodford in the 1780s, then the nine of them become the Commonwealth of Kentucky 1792.
  • Fairfax County (part) is ceded to the US for the District of Columbia 1791, * then reverted as Alexandria County 1847 (not City), then renamed Arlington County 1920.
  • Then 50 Counties become the State of West Virginia 1863.

They've got PA, MD, VA-WV, KY, NC and TN ... we should check them all out. TheVirginiaHistorian (talk) 04:14, 25 April 2011 (UTC)

Should this be included?

Just wondering if the Russell Convention which led to the Confederate government of Kentucky during the Civil war should be included in the Kentucky section? This event seems to be more substantial and more serious than some of the others listed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.133.43.115 (talk) 05:03, 16 June 2011 (UTC)

  • Ok, so why was my edit deleted? This is historical fact and seems more significant than some of the other listed proposals that were made only by individuals and not entire conventions. Not going to revert to my original edit right away because I'm not looking for an edit war, rather, I am just asking for a reasonable explaination of deleting my contribution.

Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.133.43.115 (talk) 05:44, 20 June 2011 (UTC)

  • Nevermind, the first sentence of the article explains the edit (this article about proposals to split states and not for proposals of states to leave the Union). My bad, sorry about making you waste your time in order to revert my "contribution". I'll pay better attention next time I want to make an edit. Later. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.133.43.115 (talk) 05:50, 20 June 2011 (UTC)

I didn't revert it. I rewrote it a bit and moved it to the "Confederacy-related" section. —Tamfang (talk) 02:57, 21 June 2011 (UTC)

New California partition proposal

http://www.pe.com/localnews/inland/stories/PE_News_Local_D_secede01.411b87a9f.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.75.76.27 (talk) 18:01, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

Vermont and New York

Since the adoption of the U.S. Constitution, four states have been created from parts of an existing state: Maine (from Massachusetts, West Virginia (from Virginia), Kentucky (also from Virginia), and Vermont (from New York); however, New York's claim to Vermont was dubious at best as it was asked for its consent and Vermont was essentially an independent republic until 1791.

I'm guessing this means that Congress asked the New York legislature to consent to the separate admission of Vermont, but this is not special – Maine and Kentucky would similarly require the consent of Massachusetts and Virginia – so why mention it? —Tamfang (talk) 16:33, 5 July 2011 (UTC)

Correction: Only 3 states have formed from other states since the adoption of the U.S. Constitution (Maine, West Virginia, and Kentucky). Vermont was recognized as independent from New York in 1777 but the U.S. Constitution was adopted in 1787. 68.228.92.19 (talk) 13:08, 7 July 2011 (UTC)Michael Hill, Mission Viejo CA.

Vermont, then, is in much the same boat as Ohio, Indiana etc. So does anyone object to removing Vermont from the passage? —Tamfang (talk) 03:04, 13 July 2011 (UTC)

Southern Illinois and the term "Little Egypt"

I was born in Belleville Illinois. I still live here, and call this region home. Nobody (and I mean nobody) in contemporary times uses the term "little Egypt" to describe Southern Illinois. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.217.79.89 (talk) 22:47, 3 September 2012 (UTC)

New York City secessionism

Was famously proposed by George Washington Plunkitt in the 1905 book Plunkitt of Tammany Hall ("Chapter 16: Plunkitt's Fondest Dream")... -- AnonMoos (talk) 17:26, 7 November 2012 (UTC)

Requested merger

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was not moved. --BDD (talk) 16:47, 24 April 2013 (UTC) (non-admin closure)

List of U.S. state partition proposals → List of proposed states of the United States – I propose that "List of U.S. state partition proposals" be moved to "List of proposed states of the United States", because there is considerable overlap between the two articles but the latter has a better and clearer title although the former article is more extensive and is referenced. The latter is a very recent article created by a sock-puppet of a banned user in November 2012 with ten edits including five by the banned user. The other article was created in April 2005 with hundreds of edits by many users since then. This case straddles the fence between merge proposal and move request but I think it is better discussed at RM. Green Giant (talk) 22:22, 16 April 2013 (UTC)

Survey

Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with *'''Support''' or *'''Oppose''', then sign your comment with ~~~~. Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.
  • Oppose with the following alternative solution: redirect the latter article to 51st state, which discusses the topic of potential new states (beyond mere partitions of existing ones) directly, and leave the partition article as is. J. Myrle Fuller (talk) 22:47, 16 April 2013 (UTC)
  • Oppose, most, if not all, of these are more accurately described as partition proposals rather than proposed states. older ≠ wiser 23:09, 16 April 2013 (UTC)
  • Oppose. As Bkonrad says, most of these are more accurately described as partition proposals. Moreover, not all of the entities in List of proposed states of the United States were/are accurately described as "proposals"; several of them were unilateral declarations of a new state. IMO, any unique information in List of proposed states of the United States should be merged to Historic regions of the United States or List of U.S. state partition proposals (as appropriate), and the title should be redirected to Historic regions of the United States. --Orlady (talk) 02:06, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
  • Oppose a new state can be created without partitioning an old one. Partitioning a state does not necessarily make a new state either, it could make a new country, or merge with a different state. -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 05:37, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
  • Oppose I'd agree with the above, and for precision as well. This is apples to oranges. §FreeRangeFrogcroak 23:39, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
  • Comment Pretty much with Orlady on this one. Also, if the end result(s) include merger(s), the nonsense proposals need to be retired from the content, which would require a defining of the parameters for inclusion (for example, in the Alaska section) as a group of agitators that never got anywhere with their proposal is hardly notable. GenQuest "Talk to Me" 04:07, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Discussion

Any additional comments:
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

List of U.S. state secession proposals

List of U.S. state secession proposals (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) currently redirects here. This seems very wrong, since it isn't about states wanting to secede from the Union, as the Confederate States did. -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 05:43, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

I believe that was an old name for the article, changed for that very reason. The term "secession" in this context is referring to a section of a state seceding from the rest of the state, not from the union as a whole; it is still usable (hence why the redirect was never deleted) but unclear. Besides, since the Civil War ran roughshod over the last attempt to secede from the union there have been very few serious efforts to do so. J. Myrle Fuller (talk) 06:42, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
The one for Texas is in the news quite a bit the last few years. -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 09:39, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

Tennessee difference

Explanation: Tennessee was literally the result of the Territory South of the River Ohio becoming a state, not the partition of North Carolina, so it is not one of the four partitions that directly became a state. Therefore, I reverted that claim added to the article. GenQuest "Talk to Me" 15:43, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

Alabama and Mississippi

It appears that most of Alabama and Mississippi (except for the areas bordering the Gulf of Mexico, which were part of Spanish Florida) where part of Georgia until the early 1800s (or at least claimed territory). I know they did not split from Georgia. Also, some maps show that Tennesse was part of North Carolina before becoming the Southwest Territory. Could someone explain this to me? I am confused! 24.147.1.197 (talk) 21:16, 3 June 2014 (UTC)Jacob Chesley

Secession from territories and areas pre-state

I've been going through this article for copyediting, but it does raise questions as to what material belongs here:

  • Alaska secession talks were happening while it was a territory. It became a state in 1959, so why mention activity in 1937?
  • Delaware discussion was pre-1776, before the creation of states and the Constitution in 1789.
  • Connecticut / Pennsylvania conflict up until 1786. Pre-Constitution.

-AngusWOOF (talk) 05:48, 11 September 2014 (UTC)

State proposals from territories

  • When Washington Territory was established, the populated Puget Sound region in the west dominated public affairs. The discovery of gold in present-day northern Idaho enticed settlers eastward. This shift in fortunes was followed by a proposal to establish a "Territory of Walla Walla", which was defeated in the territorial legislature in 1861.[9] The discovery of gold did contribute to the 1863 creation of Idaho Territory, however, establishing Washington's current eastern border.
  • By 1864 some residents of northern Idaho were calling for a new "Territory of Columbia" including the parts of Washington east of the Cascades or east of the Columbia River.[10] (The name Columbia was originally proposed for what is now Washington.)[11]

Citations in earlier threads

  1. ^ Balko, Radley (June 2008). "Republic of Montana: Second Amendment Secession". Reason Magazine. Retrieved 2008-09-19.
  2. ^ Beginnings of Self-Government
  3. ^ Beginnings of Self-Government
  4. ^ Sramak, Jean (February 11, 2005). mnartists.org "The Free Republic of Duluth: At Last, Real Candidates". mnartists.org. {{cite web}}: Check |url= value (help)
  5. ^ "Republic of Kinney' celebration recalls staged secession". Associated Press. 2007-07-09. {{cite web}}: Missing or empty |url= (help); Text "http://www.twincities.com/minnesota/ci_6332578" ignored (help)
  6. ^ Radil, Amy (August 17, 1998). "The Northwest Angle". Minnesota Public Radio.
  7. ^ "Campaign 2006: U.S. Congress: 7th District: Collin Peterson". Minnesota Public Radio.
  8. ^ Federalist No. 6 Footnotes
  9. ^ Edmond S. Meany (1909). History of the State of Washington. Macmillan Company. p. 236.
  10. ^ "Early Nez Perce County" (PDF). Idaho State Historical Society. 1963.
  11. ^ Cite error: The named reference McClelland 1988 was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
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