Talk:Das Geheimnis der Santa Margherita

Title

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved to Das Geheimnis der Santa Margherita, the original German title ―cobaltcigs 22:01, 6 March 2020 (UTC)

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The Secret of Satana Magarita →

1. The Secret of St. Margaret,
2. The Secret of Santa Margherita, or:
3. The Secret of Santa Margareta.

Background info:

• Clearly the original title German: Das Geheimnis der Santa Margherita translates to "The Secret of" followed by a proper name.
• Apparently in this context that name refers neither to a canonized person (which would usually be anglicized), nor to a geographical location (which would usually be left alone), but rather to a boat—a boat sunk by one Archduke Johann Salvator of Austria (what do we do with boats? I don't even know…).
• To further complicate matters, Johann's article spells the ship a third way—"Santa Margareta"—in a paragraph sourced to The New York Times. I found that interesting and tried to access the text of this NYT article, but apparently they've got it pay-walled (despite being long-since public domain). But the Google Search excerpt of a follow-up article appears to confirm NYT's use of the third spelling, which is significant because NYT is probably the earliest English-language source that (a) mentions this specific boat, and (b) is still marginally accessible. Here are three different urls pointing to old newspaper scans which probably all mention this boat by name. Nothing on archive.org for any of them, I checked. So if anybody has a subscription to access this content, feel free to repost it all somewhere more accessible. Because it's literally older than your mom.
  1. https://www.nytimes.com/1890/12/26/archives/the-missing-archduke.html
  2. https://www.nytimes.com/1890/12/29/archives/herr-johann-orths-fate-hope-for-his-vessels-safety-given-up.html
  3. https://www.nytimes.com/1909/05/12/archives/machinist-says-he-is-the-lost-archduke-i-am-the-second-cousin-of.html

Conclusions:

• If contemporary NYT usage is sufficient to say "Santa Margareta" is the preferred English-language name for the boat in question, I'd choose option C as the best way to translate the title of a film about said boat.
• Otherwise maybe it would be a toss-up between A and B?
• The current title looks like confused gibberish and I have no theory how it came about.
• Edit: Perhaps inserting the definite article before the ship name would also be necessary.

―cobaltcigs 19:45, 28 February 2020 (UTC)

• Move to Das Geheimnis der Santa Margherita. Absolutely no evidence that it's ever seen in English translation. Per WP:USEENGLISH and WP:COMMONNAME we don't translate titles for the sake of it. Given the various possible translations and no evidence for a definitive one, it's far better just to leave it in the original German. -- Necrothesp (talk) 11:43, 6 March 2020 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.